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guns for self defense
That's true but if you need more than one shot your probably in really deep kim shee. Most CCW type revolvers are 5 shot with medium frames being 6. A compact 45 gives 7. The extra shot to me is of no consequence in comparison to what I would be comfortable with. There generally speaking is no right or wrong, just better choices for each individual. I know some one posted about being able to miss with a scatter gun which might be true in the field but at 10'-20' with buckshot I know I would be very hard pressed to miss. Cant go wrong with the pump action or wheel guns for mechanical simplicity.
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guns for self defense
I don't like a shotgun OR a rifle for what I call "home defense" because they both require two hands to operate. I guess if an evil gang of compact tractor owners was rolling through my yard, a shotgun would be great. I could step out on the front porch and start blasting. Or, join them. But I envision a scenario more like this one: I'm sleeping soundly with my wife at my side, and am suddenly awakened. I realize that somebody else is ALREADY IN THE ROOM and is coming toward us. Or, even if the bad guys were in the HOUSE, I'd still have to go room-to-room to clear them out. Need to carry a flashlight, and a free hand to open doors, deflect other weapons, etc.
For some, home defense may mean more protecting livestock from 4-legged predators, or a patrol-type situation. In that case, I'd think a semi-auto rifle with a flashlight mounted to it would be the trick.
Also, I have to agree with the comment about single action autos and operating them under stress. While I've run several thousand rounds through a .45 Gov't Colt, you just wouldn't believe how many ways you can mess up under stress. What works on the range sometimes just doesn't work when things go bad. I practice with my Glock almost exclusively, because that is what I carry (legally in my state), when I carry.
Bill
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guns for self defense
I certainly agree with your scenario. I do not ever recall keeping a shot gun for home defense and for me a rifle is completely out of the question. We all live in different places though so it may well be different for others. I certainly would not want a SA revolver for this purpose so if it is not clear I assume we are only talking autos. I guess I just dont see all the ways to mess up with a SA automatic. It really seams to me that by far the largest debate for the two is one of concealed carry. Regular carry is really moot in my opinion as you have zero element of suprise and is simply impractical for the majority in daily use. The real debate there for most is carrying "Cocked and locked" not screwing up when drawing. If that or mechanical function is the concern a DA revolver cures all the problems associated with the debate. Unless you are in law enforcement then certainly the capacity in this day and age is of paramount importance. For home defense I just dont see the confusion or margin for mess ups, when you draw you drop. If I sweep the house the safety is already off. S/A or D/A the first choice is simply what works best for you and what you are most comfortable with. It really is a timeless debate. The far greater concern to me is the law. To my knowledge Texas is the best state to live in for home defense.
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guns for self defense
Gentlemen
I was respoding to the question of MY preference. The question was what would I use. In my sitution I actually have a 308 fn-fal and 40 glock by my bed. A little farther is the Python,Ruger and Rem 1100. I have 2 "Outside" dogs and two "inside" dogs so unless a true NINJA Warrior is after me I will have a little time to wake and asses the situation. When I have been awakened I go for the Colt and a Sure fire Flashlight. I like choices. I dont want to tell you how much I spend on ammo, lets just say I reload to shoot more not to save money.
Every one has to make a decision about their sitution and act on it. "My" preference for the three stands. My advice is whatever "YOU" get PRACTICE PRACTICE PR... you get the picture. Just last week a Black Bear was in a tree 10 yards from the house. All 4 dogs did their job and I did mine with a 9mm that was the closest tool handy. Just scared him off. I would have preferred the 308 but the 9 with 15 rounds of Corbon Might have slowed him down enough to give me time to get upstairs. It just goes to show you never can tell.
Tracer
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guns for self defense
Tracer, I can only speak for myself but I dont think any one was suggesting you are wrong for a rifle choice. We all have different situations and needs and comfort levels. If I did not have a NEED for a ccw I would not even own a hand gun. As much as I like the shooting sports, I personally have never really enjoyed them. That is just personal coice. I do appreciate good workmanship in any thing so I have my favorites but I see them pretty much just as a tool. That is just my perspective. Practice is so important I dont think we could possibly overstate it.
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guns for self defense
I already have a Glock 21 45cal. I have had it for years and it's kind of like that old pair of sneakers that you wore and wore so many times, but they still feel so comfortable you don't want new ones. My wife has a (cheap&hammerless)taurus 38 just about as used as my glock.
The only other guns we have are, a Harrington & Richardson single shot shotgun that I only keep because it was the first gun my dad bought me. And the other was my dad's sidearm in WWII it's a 25cal (don't laugh) he was in the rear with the gear. It says on it: automatic pistol"UNION I" cal 6.35, in the grip he has a picture of him and his mother and on the other side is a picture of my mother is her british uniform. All in a brown leather holster and to me it is priceless.
I use to hunt about 16yrs ago with a 30.06 that I gave to 1 of my brothers.
Where we live bears and coyotees are not are problem, our county is slowly becoming part of that larger metropolis known as the northeast corridor running between boston and DC. Still alot of open space left but it's shrinking. The only thing to worry about here is the human filth that prey and I want to be able to do more than pray if they get into our house. I am seriously considering a good shotgun, and the high output rifle is kinda something I always wanted.
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guns for self defense
I keep a Magnum Research Baby Desert Eagle close at hand. Its .40 S&W bore can provide the necessary knock down and great accuracy with its 6 inch, hexagonal rifling. I bought it a few years back right before the majority of Police forces in my area were making the switch from 9mm to the .40S&W in my area. With 10 round mag rated capacity, it could be coaxed into holding 12 though this is techinically illegal now. Mine is not though. I'll settle for ten. Its ballistics are interesting, providing similar knock down capabilities as a 357 although not quite as much and much better than a nine. Plus the gun has the best comdort and feel of any handgun I've ever tried. Well balanced and a quality feel. It is made in Israel by Israeli Military Industries, the manufacturers of UZI. The gun was briefly imported by Mossberg and was branded UZI baby eagle for a while before Magnum research repurchased the gun.
Available with 4 inch barrel and in composite as well. My favorite feature, besides the quick breakdown, is the ambidextrous nature of the gun. Decocker included in saftey with firing pin block.
Also, I keep a 12 guage rifled slug gun (sabot slugs) with a 24 inch barrel. This gun would literally bring down an elephant. I've never had a deer walk off when it makes contact. They make some nasty slugs for this thing. Although a single shot, it is quickly reloaded and has little potential to jam with its powerful ejectors. Also, it can be shot with a load of buckshot or birdshot as needed. With its short barrel, it is the next best thing to a sawed-off shotgun. Plus if you run out, the sheer weight of the gun makes for plenty of lethal hand to hand.
Last, but not least, a rifle is always need. I am looking for another now. But I have come to the conclusion that the SKS 7.62 rifles are a great value. These tamed down semi auto versions of the AK 47's are durable and cheap. They have been manufactured by the millions and are carried by many(ahem!) military regimes. They take dirt sand and water with little problems. Also pre-ban models will accept the bannana clips. No ammo shortage here. If I recall correctly, I believe the Romananian built ones are the most coveted, although many egyptian and chinese models are out there. Ammo is cheap too! Sporterized nylon stock models are worth the investment, because, they make a decent mid range large game rifle.
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guns for self defense
MY choices 1 govn't 1911 it don't jam and nothing walks away
2 20ga Rem.21"bar.wife can cover the whole side of the room
3 Ruger 1022 it does everything
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guns for self defense
I have been away for a few days, so there are lots of posts on this topic.
I wanted to address the shotgun issue, just a bit. Shotguns certainly take two hands to operate, well. For some that is a good thing. I taught shooting sports at a state university and I also taught the NRA hunter safety course for years and I have had this question about guns for home defense posed to me several dozen times. (I also shot on the pistol team.)
Those that refer to practicing and developing a high level of skill are on target. For me, I do like a pistol for home defense as well as a shotgun. In a quick situation, I get the pistol that is ready to go from the bedside. If I have a little more time, the first gun that I get is the shotgun.
The statistics are not good for inexperienced users and pistols. Hitting the target is an anomoly rather than the rule, and the chances of having the gun taken away by an intruder are significant. Shotguns have the advantage of a long sight radius making "pointing" more practical. In addition, it is very difficult to grab the business end of a shotgun and take it away from someone holding it in two hands.
Fortunately, the mere presence of a firearm results in the end of the confrontation in many cases. The larger and more destructive looking the gun is, the less likely it is that you will have to use it, but if you do, that is exactly what you want.
So, my stock answer when someone will little or no gun experience says to me, "I am worried about crime and I think that I want to buy a gun; what should I get?" I always tell them a 12 ga pump riot gun. For the most part, these users are not going to be gun enthusiasts and will not practice. They probably will stick the gun in the corner of the closet, never oil it or dust it off. But, short of having a mud dauber wasp build a nest in the end of the barrel, that 12 ga is going to work when and if they need it.
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guns for self defense
ACZ Did You get a smoker yet ? I am not sure I could completely agree with the above statement, although I respect your opinion. I guess I would never reccomend a gun to someone with zero experience in the first place that just wanted piece of mind. The problem I have with the shotgun scenario is that like you said they do get left loaded in the corner collecting dust. They dont get put away while the owners are at work or vacation and all too often not when the kids are playing around them. Sidearm lock boxes are nice for hand guns. I do however completely agree about the hand gun reccomendation.
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06-26-2003, 18:48 
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