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guns for self defense
The BATF letters are only for documented and BATF approved antiques. I have never seen a scattergun qualify. A class 3 Firearms DEALERS license is required to posses theese shorter barrels as their primarly intent of manufactuture is for law inforcement. I would like to play with one but I would not want to own one. While I will not run from trouble I see no point in courting it either. On another note. ACZ you mentioned the brady law. Is it just my wishfull imagination or did I read that law is going to expire. I know I read that the assault weapons ban is to be lifted and is not going to be attempted to get re-instated. I guess the thing I fear the most is that all of the anti-gun legislation law pushers have gotten savy enough to keep their mouth shut untill they get elected. Homedad, you can still get that Wilson Combat with the 18 or 20" barrel, I just would think a regular 870 would be a whole LOT cheaper.
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Sorry to stir the pot. I have seen the bad side of fire arms. Doc, freedom is no joke. My profile on a website dedicated to Compact tractors has nothing to do with anything remotely serious. My apologies to all.
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guns for self defense
Doc, the 14 inch and shorter 870's a purely for SWAT entry teams. When you go balls to butt in a "stick" with a bunch of guys, the short barrels are really handy.
They are intended for use in average sized rooms and can engage a suspect at arms length if it comes to that.
If you have one on a team sling you can let it go and it stays inside the confines of you body and does not get tangled up in doorways and such.
They are dangerous..... it is really easy to get your support hand in front of the muzzle at the WRONG moment. That is why most of them have a backward facing curved guard at the end of the forearm.
There is no tactical advantage that I can see for Joe Homeowner to have a barrel shorter than 18 inches.
Nor does it make any sense to load your home defense shotgun with slugs, unless you are anticipating dueling it out with suspects clad in body armor.
The best slugs on the market, Brenneke's, are completely capable of dispatching any animal that walks the earth. In Alaska we routinely dealt with the biggest deer on earth.
On the several occasions I used a 12 gauge slug to dispatch a injured moose, I had to maneuver the shot so that it would run the length of the animal. We simply could not keep the those slugs in the biggest moose on broadside and angling shots. Not good in a residential setting.
I once shot a two year old grizzly off someone's front porch. The slug entered at the base of the neck, completely traversed the animal and exited near the usual metabolic exhaust port.
I found the slug later, buried in the earth behind the critter. It had a wad of hair the size of a golf ball wrapped around it that had attached upon entry and had traveled completely through Mr.Troubled Teenage Bear with the slug.
Then there was the time I shot a Brenneke through a cinderblock, AFTER it had already defeated a class III A vest and 14 inches of newspaper.
No. You don't need slugs in your home defense shotgun....
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Mark, You wont get any argument from me there. Like I said the 14" are for law enforcement but they do make a "average joe", model with 18" and20" barrels. "IF" I were to go the scattergun route I would choose a 870 with one of those Vang Comp barrels you pointed out before. I mean to tell you friend that was an IMPRESSIVE pattern. How did slugs come up ?? It would seem to rather make the scattergun argument for being less likely to miss a somewhat moot point. I would think Buckshot would be the pick of the day.
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mark, This is a bit off topic. At one point I worked for the airlines for several years. One of the things we used to do was get a 747 halfway in a hanger so the SWAT team could practice. Seeing those guys hanging on the side of that bird was enough of a rush to skip coffe the next day. Then there was the Treasury boys and their short scatterguns. Believe me, when they are unloading Shrink wrapped bundles of new money out of the belley there is enough fire power around to put a third world country down. And they dont screw around. 
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I think Vang Comp's 870 express with light,sling and side saddle might be the one for me. But I'm still looking.
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"It's clear to me that the knowledge about guns here is vast. I have a question to pose, if you had to pick 3 guns for the "panic room" of the house 1 handgun, 1 rifle, 1 shotgun for both the wife and the husband what would they be? Keep in mind that there use would be in close quarters and could involve many assailants."
I think it boils down to get whatever you are comfortable with and are likely to PRACTICE with. If you buy the "Gorilla Stopper" and load it with the hottest loads you can find sure it'll stop anything but you probably aren't going to want to practice with it. You'll, be sore, have ringing ears and be broke from expensive ammo. This is especially true if you're not accustomed to firing a gun.
You also may have to factor in another persons ability to handle the gun if your spouse will also be relying on it for protection.
As far as my choice in your scenario I don't see what use the rifle would be, at as you said "close quarters" Shotguns are nice but I think I could fire accurately, faster with my handgun. But that's just me and it's what I am comfortable handling, you might feel different. I have 6 handguns and if forced I would rely on the two 9mm Glock 19's for which I have eight 15 round magazines. Not the most powerful handgun round ever invented but it's easy to shoot rapidly and accurately and I know it will do the job if I do. One of these Glocks was my wife's when she was a police officer so she knows the gun very well also.
If I really wanted the shotgun I like the Winchester Defender model 1300 with an 18" barrel. My brother has one, it holds 8 shells is easy to pump and fire rapidly and you can get a variety of stocks/grips and tactical accesories for little $$$$. He's had it for 15 years without a problem. I think it was around $275.
Come to think of it he has offered it to me in the past...I may just swipe it from him 
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F-350. In that scenario I would want the scattergun exclusively. CQCB being the key, I would take a 870, a 870 and a 870. Anyone can handle recoil when the adreniline is going. Reliable, simple function, big pattern.
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Billy...there are lots of things that can be legally owned with the right credentials and BATF paperwork. I see no useful purpose for me to have a shotgun shorter than 18", but until I can find a specific prohibition, I have to assume that it is covered by the other DD regulations that include the USAS and Streetsweeper shotguns. The only reason that I mentioned it is that a 14" short shotgun was mentioned previously. I think that such a short shotgun qualifies as a very close quarters offensive weapon, not a weapon that is good for self defense.
Doc...I think that the Brady law is due to expire sometime soon. I mentioned it sort of tongue in cheek. You would think that if a criminal fills out a sacred federal firearms form and lies on said form that he should be prosecuted. If the data doesn't lie, then that would be the "number of firearms kept out of criminal hands" that is touted by the Brady advocates. But, unfortunately, the amount of prosecutions for such offenses is almost non-existent.
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Non existant is right. What a dissgrace. Any one who thinks that there is no need need to worry about looseing our guns to big brother only has to review the statistics there. Nothing but good old tracking Mr. Average Joe Citizens activitys so we know right where to go first.
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07-07-2003, 16:13 
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