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Mississippi - state of mind
Peters
I didn't say I could not find the 1860 Census, I said I could NOT find YOUR figures and your percentages that you were quoting from the 1860 census. I posted the total SLAVE OWNERs and it is not important how many slaves there were, we were talking about OWNERS and that I posted., TWICE.
I agree with you on Bakker, Roberts, Swaggert and the rest of the PTO or Make Me Money from your Stupidty Group.
I do not care to compare notes though on the merits of Christ.
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Mississippi - state of mind
WW: Your original statement was "“For Christ sake, 99% of the boys who fell under the Red & Gray had no idea what a slave was, never owned a slave, couldn't have owned one if they wanted to and were dying for their State and not for anything to do with Slavery.”
You also stated that there were 8,099,760 in the south and 384,000 slave owners. My calculation are more like 394,000 but enough said about that. 384,000/8,099760 is what percentage? I calculate near 5%. As only men went to war and in that day and age men held most of the wealth you could say near 10 percent of the men owned slaves. The number of people in the south does not represent house holds. If we assume the average house hold at the time was 5 then we have 2 million people in house holds with slaves and this is close to the stats I found gave of 33%. This is much different than 1%.
In the state in question MS, there were 450,000 slaves and 300,000 non slaves. There were about 31,000 slave holders. Again assume household averages of 5 you have 155,000 which is similar to the data I provide of 50%. Actually the number of families was 63,015.
I might be just the majority of the young men going to war were not the head of their own households and called to go to war, but the household I grew up in is slave based one. The society in which I live was slave dependent. They were living off the profit of a slave based economy. Like I stated in a county like Winston AL there was debate and rejection of the concept that they should go to war for the slaveholders.
EW and Ken; "Why are you here?" can be asked in many ways, but I don't remember anyone asking this question to someone from another country living in Canada. Your not from around here are you? Is basicly the same question although a little more direct and not necessarily directed to someone from another country, just anyone with a different accent.
If you look at the 1860 census from MS you had 750,000 people. Last census we had 2.85 million, therefore the population has only increased 4 times in 140 years. As the world population has increase about 4X in the last 50 years and the US population is 11 times since 1860 we can only assume that a lot of people have moved from MS to other territories, including Canada in the last 140 years. If Mississippians are migrating to other areas of North America for 140 years, why shouldn't someone migrate to MS? I don't know some of this might be an inferiority complex. I think I have been posed the question in both ways. Your not welcome and how could you be so stupid as to move here.
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Mississippi - state of mind
Peters
You Dance a good Dance.
Yes! I did say "For Christ sake, 99% of the boys who fell under the Red & Gray had no idea what a slave was, never owned a slave, couldn't have owned one if they wanted to and were dying for their State and not for anything to do with Slavery." your point??
Only 93,000 Southern Confederate Soldiers died in Combat. 93,000 out of strength of just over a million one hundred, that is just under 9% Killed IN COMBAT. Those 93,000 came from all over the South and NOT just Mississippi.
You got your 394,000 because you added states that were NOT apart of the Confederacy but stopped Slave owning with the election of Lincoln. Maryland, Kentucky and Missouri had Slaves but were not part of the Confederate States.
http://www.civil-war.net/searchofficialrecords.asp?searchofficialrecords=McClellan%20Antietam Great site to get numbers from. Has all of the 1860 Census info.
Looking at the numbers per state I added ONLY the Confederate State population and got 9,083,000 including Slaves, I added all the Families for there was a distinct number for Families and I got 1,555,262, it doesn't say if it included Slave families or not. There were 316,413 Slave Owners in the whole of the Confederacy. Now if you look at the Total Population for the Confederacy and the total KIA you have 1%, back off the Slaves from the population and you will still have UNDER 2% of the total population KIA'd. I will continue to say the majority of the Confederate KIAs did NOT own slaves.
To say that the 2% killed, came from the Non Slave owning families would be possible considering who serves and who does not. Who was educated and who was not. etc.
There is a flaw in that web site and I am sure that is the site you retrieved your info from. The flaw? read slowly.
For Mississippi it says there were 63015 Total Families
then it says there were 30,943 Slave Owners and right below that it says Total Familes that owned Slaves 49%. WRONG! The site is comparing Slave Owners to Families and then declaring the answer gives a total percentage of Families that own slaves. Wrong! It assumes there can be no more than ONE SLAVE OWNER per Family and that is pure hogwash. You could have 3 brothers and a Father from the Same family own slaves and be apart of the Total Number of Owners and yet be only a part of a single family. The data in the Premises is correct but the Conclusion is FALSE. Total number of Families owning slaves IS NOT 49%, the RATIO of SLAVE OWNER to FAMILY is. You would have to have a poll of each family that owned slaves. I have no doubt as I said earlier from another site, that there were some Owners who owned 100s of slaves. The Large Cotton Fields needed labor for the job, the Combine had not been invented yet. Families and their cousins could have owned one Large Plantation and they would make up a substantial Slave Owning number but would be only ONE or Two Families. So even Census can sum up false info.
My whole point was to preserve the Southern Flag because I do not believe it represents Slavery as much as it does SACRIFICE, period.
Play with numbers all you want and challenge my 99% but the point was what the Flag stood for. Not how many slaves there were.
The Civil War was NOT about Slaves it was about Economics and the Wealthy Slave owners had the greatest influence and control as well as Political influence, that is what scared the industrialized North and in order to beat the Wealth, Power and Influence of the Slave owners, it was best done by abolishing the means that gave them the Wealth and Power and that was where Slavery stepped in. You could compare the Slave owners to Organized Crime bosses of the 20s and 30s. They basically spoke for everyone, so to speak, only because everyone else was too busy and had no idea what was going on.
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Mississippi - state of mind
I don't understand your math or logic.
In the seven states that succeeded first SC 26701 slave holders and 58642 families or 46%, GA 41084 slave holders and 109910 families or 37%, AL 33730 slave holders and 96603 families 35%, MS 30993 slave holders and 63015 families or 49%, LA 22033 slave holders and 74725 families or 29%, TX 21878 slave holders and 76781 families or 28%, FL 5152 slave holders and 15090 families or 34%. 494766 families and 181521 slave holders or 37%
The states that seceded after attack of fort Sumter are: VA 26%, NC 28%, TN 25%, and AR 20%. 533192 families and 135111 slave holders or 25%.
In the Confederacy 1027958 families and 316632 slave holders or 31%
WW "For Christ sake, 99% of the boys who fell under the Red & Gray had no idea what a slave was, never owned a slave, couldn't have owned one if they wanted to and were dying for their State and not for anything to do with Slavery.”
Basically one third of the families in the south owned slaves. If you considered extended families, aunts, uncles and grandparents there were few counties where everyone did not have contact with slaves in their immediate families. I doubt anyone in a grey uniform did not know that this war was concerning slaves and the ability to own them.
Slave families were not counted, they were never even given last names and many took the names of their slave holders after the war. I showed you in the link to the data from VA. If you look in the cemeteries and I don't need to go too far in this county, the black and white family names are the same.
I agree that the bulk of the enlistment would have come from the poorer segment of society, but the south was twice as wealthy as the south, at least concerning the men that counted (i.e. white). It seems to me that you subscribe to the trickle down theory of economics of the republicans of late so we can assume that they were fighting to keep their money and way of life. Would not the average soldier in the Confederacy have greater wealth than the north? Many in the north enlisted in the north for the money, I am not sure this was the case in the south.
The election prior to the war was fought over slavery, Lincoln was known as an abolitionist, all you need to do is go and read some of his speeches from the campaign trail. The southern 7 state seceded soon after he won.
If you look at the battles in the civil war and the number of hours that soldiers had to sit around and talk or march and talk. You believe that 99% of them had no idea what the war was about and had no idea what slavery was about? The field commanders in the war were not sitting in a bunker 100 miles from the front, but riding a horse in front of the troops.
Call me simple, but the Confederacy lasted four years, before this time the States were part of the US and after this time they were part of the US, why are these states promoting a battle flag of a failed revolt unless it is in defiance of the union? You might say it is in respect of the soldiers that fought, but the average guy in the south with the Southern Cross on the truck is not showing respect for the fallen any more than the white supremacist is wearing the swastika for the fallen Germans.
Now for the kicker, what MS state flag? The bill in 1894 making it the official flag was rescinded in 1906 and no flag has been legislated to replace it or make it official again. Law suits to remove it have been thrown out as there is no legal flag (see below).
In MS little had changed since slavery in the 1950’s for the black population. As my friend stated he was a slave. When the Brown decision came down they decided to make the Sovereignty Commission (1956) to combat the integration. They were allowed to use any measure necessary to prevent the intrusion of the federal government. To a greater or lesser extent you had state funded terrorism. During integration the use of the battle flag reappeared and therefore it is associated with racism like it or not.
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Mississippi - state of mind
Peters
My Math is very simple and yours is messed up, your percentages in the first paragraph of your post are worthless and meaningless. You can NOT take the Total Number of families and devide by the number of slave holders and then claim a percent of families owned Slaves. Christ, learn basic math and logic would you. You are on a wild tangent and you are using a Faulty source. I have been to the web site and it is WRONG. The Total NUMBER of FAMILIES devided by the TOTAL NUMBER OF SLAVE OWNERS does NOT, I repeat DOES NOT GIVE YOU A PERCENT OF FAMILIES WHO OWN SLAVES. your source is hogwash, so quit quoting garbage. You are WRONG! You have NO idea what you are talking about and you are adding your own assumptions into False data taken from a web site that had a a WRONG conclusion as I pointed out to you.
Find yourself a third grade math teacher and have them explain to you in person. YOU ARE WRONG. end of discussion.
You also have no clue what soldiers talk about, NOW or 140 years ago.
The point you have gone so far from was when I said the Confederate Flag and the Mississippi Flag needs to be flown with Pride, not from owning Slaves, I made that clear. But from sacrifice and call of duty. You preach your faith and how you devote your life to it. Same with a FLAG. I don't care if you don't put any value in the flag because you think the Bible forbids it, good for you. You do not control my thoughts and it is clear to see you act like a Parakeet, it doesn't matter if your sources have wrong information, you don't understand what you read, so you quote it as truth. Once again, I will say it again slowly.
YOU CAN NOT TAKE THE TOTAL FAMILIES, DEVIDE BY THE TOTAL OF SLAVE OWNERS AND COME UP WITH THE PERCENT OF FAMILIES WHO OWNED SLAVES. IMPOSSIBLE. G.I.G.O. Which stands for Garbage In, Garbage Out.
Find another subject you have done poorly here.
Many people will abuse any flag. regardless, that does not mean it should not be respected by those of us who are above the those standards. I have seen the U.S. flag, burned, trampled, pissed on, shit on, and dragged down the streets. I am above them and they are my enemies for they put evil above good and preach that the flag is a symbol of murder and evil. Their ignorance does not justify disrespect for any flag that a decent man has died for, period. I bet you have never asked one of those pick up truck owners why they have the flag have you? My brother lives in Normandy Tenn and he flies it and it is on his pick up and he flies it for Southern Pride and he doesn't own a slave, never has, came from the North, will talk and drink a beer with a Black man any day of the week. I for one beleive very strongly, that you have Niggers and you have Blacks and you have Honkies and you have Whites. I do not associate myself with the trash or the honkies or the niggers, I prefer to associate with the Whites and the Blacks. Is Pride something you rather call by every other name than Pride? You assume every pick up with the Rebel Flag flies it because he wants to own a slave? You see Slavery in the Rebel Flag, maybe Peters is the one with Tunnel Vision and refuse to see what it really means. I can see you become easily obsessed with a thought as you did with WRONG information here, maybe you have other wrong information as well and you think the rebel Flag is an Insult. My ancestors served with the Vermont Volunteers and we are buried on many battlefield. My family has fought from the Revolution right up to Iraq. Myself and every brother has served. I support the War in Iraq because I believe 24 million Iraqiis have a right to basic human life, without having to live in Fear or oppression. Do I sound like a Slave Supporter? I hold Flags in very high order and I do not support slavery in the least bit and yet I have the greatest respect for the southern soldier and their flag. Why Peters, why would a Yankee support the South/ BECAUSE it has NOTHING to do with SLAVERY, but Honor, Pride, Devotion, Sacrifice, Courage, Love, Respect.
You claim to know what a soldier was thinking. Maybe slaves were mentioned in the early days, by a very few, of the suspected one week war. But when that week turned into months and years and New soldiers came and died, they did not have SLAVES on their lips. When they pulled the trigger and felled a man in Blue it wasn't for the thought they would own a slave if they killed enough Yankees. Slavery Peters, was an excuse and maybe even the Heart but not the reason. When the Southern boy returned home after the war with a leg or an arm missing, I doubt the bar talk was "Damn I can't own any slaves now"
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Mississippi - state of mind
while we're dragging the South through the mud, why don't we delve into how the white Pilgrims robbed and murdered the indians, then let's move on to the wrongful annexation of mexican territories and Hawaii and conclude with the discussion of the rasist policies of FDR that resulted in the incarceration of Japanese during the WWII. And when we're done let's all shoot ourselves because white men are and have always been good for nothing and caused nothing but problems for this world.
"the average guy in the south with the Southern Cross on the truck is not showing respect for the fallen any more than the white supremacist is wearing the swastika for the fallen Germans"
Wow! take it easy, will you?
If memory serves me right, I think it was Marx who said "the way to defeat a nation is to rob it of its history". Our enemies are sure getting there.
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Mississippi - state of mind
WW: You do not know what you are talking about. In the census a household is one family. The head of the household filled out the statistics for the census. One head of house hold means one family. Even if the person is single but is the head of a house hold he is counted as a family. If there are 63 thousand households and 31 thousand slave holders in MS then where do the extra slave holders go? How does 49% become 1%? The only way the stats could be skewed the way you are proposing was if there were a lot of corporations which held slaves. This was not the case in 1860. There was no reason to incorporate a business and most if not all were family farms.
I know statistics and have studied math far beyond where you finished off. You have not shown me to be wrong, only how pig headed you are.
Personally I could care less that you and your family were in the US military. Like the 4 years of the civil war is this the only experience that guides the rest of your life? Is this your shining achievement? Who told you that you deserve special treatment because of it? Who told you, you were special in some way? Who told you that you have special knowledge because of your experience? Who told you that you were better than I? Members of family have served in the military since the French and Indian wars. The Vietnam War was over before I was of age and I injured my knee smoke jumping while serving the state in college. I led teams of men in the woods and everything under the sun was discussed to kill time. Maybe you were part of a stupid platoon? Some of the crews I led were work release from the Pen. I find it hard to believe that marines are stupider than cons, but you said it not I.
You call me a parakeet. I was trained to think, problem solve and create new ideas. I have patents, thesis and papers that state that this information is new and no one in the world has thought of this before. Do you? Or are you just parroting what you have read, been told and fit with your point of view. I am willing to change my mind if you can show me where I am wrong. You have not, nor do you seem capable. You fault my source of data, mainly the University of Virginia stats. What source are you using and what slant does it have? The one bit of information you posted has nothing to do with the question.
If one in three in the south is from a slave holding family what is the probability that just one in one hundred dies on the battle field? What is the probability that one in one hundred has no idea what a slave is? I can do the math for you but you obviously can not comprehend.
Posted below someone’s calculations that confirm the estimates and number I posted. Sorry to be so obstinate but I live and work here. I have been here far longer than EW and I am near the prairie where the slave holders mainly where. I deal with the problems that were not resolved 140 years ago every day. I have discussed the flag on the back of the truck with natives in MS. In fact I had the discussion with a young man a week and a half ago and last week with some one from South Carolina last week on a plane.
Denis: I am sorry this post has spread out so long and degraded to name calling. I have tried to stay above that, but WW has started to use my name and my God’s name in vain. Which is has end in other threads so a guess it can be expected. Those that forget history are destined to repeat it. I have studied a lot of history both in university and on my own. Most of history in the text book is a white washed version of the truth. Few scholars give the facts and present war as it is, a messy and dangerous affair where stupidity and indecision abound. For example we all learned about the war of 1812. Some from one side some from the other. Pierre Berton wrote a scholarly book called “Flames Across the Border”. It details the conflict and the actions on both sides. If you read it you arrive at the conclusion that both sides were a bunch of Pratts and it is a wonder that anything was ever resolved. The stupidity was not just the politicians, but extended to all levels of the military. On both sides it is considered a victory in the school texts.
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Mississippi - state of mind
Peters
I am afraid it is YOU who does not know what they are talking about. The rules of the Head of household did not come into play until after 1913 with adoption of the Federal Income Tax Amendment. More than one member of a family could very easily own a slave and be counted as seperate Slave owners. Sorry Peters, you numbers are full of holes one BIG one when you try to devide number of families by number of SINGLE slave owners and come up with a Percent of Families who own slaves. It is a drastic assumption with no merit for fact.
It really doesn't matter who is head of household etc, we are talking 1860 and for all you know the Slave owner could be a slave owner in several states. Most Cotton fields cross state lines without prejudice. Even today that is true.
No one has used your name or God's name in vain, there you go making up stuff again. Where was I asking for Special Treatment? You make shit up as you go along and you believe your own B.S. Good God Peters, I made statements and I really don't care what you think. You started this whole thread for posts I had in another thread so end your B.S. and your Holy God crap. You are very predujiced for a self-proclaimed religous person and you assume way too much and you put people in catagories because they have a flag decal on their pick up or they fly a pecticular flag.
I have No Doubt you are one of those people who think the war in Iraq is over OIL. The Civil War was about Economics and who controlled the raw goods needed by a growing nation. Yes! slavery was used to harvest, that is the only reason why Slavery was sought to be abolished, because abolishing slavery took power away from the Wealthy few who owned hundreds and control a huge chunk of the Raw Materials.
Unless your major was the Civil War and you are a recognized source on the Civil War all of your thesis, patents and education is meaningless. Doctors are smart in their own field but are just as ignorant as the next guy in areas they are not educated in. I have read hundreds of pages of Civil War Diaries, been to dozens of battlefields, have read hundreds of books on the Civil War, I have done micro fiche research with the Harpers, Charleston and several other papers of the period, studied Military History, but you are right, you are an educated fool and know more than I do about the Civil War. You judge the 1860s with a mind buried in 2006, people back then were very uneducated only a select few could even write their names. Most people had their last names changed during the Civil War, because Paymasters would sound out the name or drop letters from it. The Press did the same thing and many had no idea how to really spell their own names. BUT you will tell me that they were able, with out computers or machines be able to tell if people were counted more than once, if they were owners in more that one state and had accurate counts and dealt with ONLY Head of households and only counted the same family once and no other census taker counted them again and so forth and so on and that if you devide the number of families by the number of slave owners you will get an accurate percent of families who owned slaves. That the Census Taker who rode a buggy or a Horse, actually did an Accurate count and rode to every house to check on the validity of the information he supposedly gathered. No short cuts, no lying, no made up numbers all 100% accurate because Peters wants it to be. Peters, your ignorance of the period is showing.
You claim to be better in Math and yet you have No idea about my credentials, you are assuming again. You have side stepped my point about the false conclusions drawn from the two base premises and they were 1. TOTAL NUMBER OF FAMILIES
2. TOTAL NUMBER OF SLAVE OWNERS and you insist that with those two numbers and ONLY those two numbers you can conclude the following PERCENT OF FAMILIES WHO OWNED SLAVES. For someone who claims to be so good in Math, you have stood by pure B.S., My best advice to you, go back and take Math and Logic over, you slept during the important part of class.
Good Day, and you are the Bible man and not me, so if I take the Lord's name in vain, which I haven't, it is of NO CONCERN of yours. You need to stick to a subject you think you know more about.
I would take one Marine over 1000 of you any day of the week. Marines are stupider than Cons? Really? where did you gain that conclusion from? My my Peters how arrogant you are. I never once implied any thing of the sort and I never implied I was better nor that I was looking for Special Treatment. You cried to Denis saying there was Nasme calling. MY MY how you lead the pack, Ignorant is not Name Calling, it is stating a fact when someone is not aware of the real information. Now you have flown your True flag and your posts will merit no worthiness by me. WoW! You avoided the Draft by sitting around with work crews.. Atta Boy, I used to use Prisoners as well to clear grass and the such around Ordinance bunkers. BIG DEAL. You jumped too! WoW! so didn't I, except I did it in the Marines. You put out fires? WOW! I mixed Napalm and started them. Used some W.P. as well and some good ole Det Cord.  . Good Day Peters, I really don't care about you, you have proven to me, who you are. You claim that you can't learn History from Text books and then quote some Book. real piece of work you are. Now we are going to play playground games, and you assume you are more wise than I and because I am military I must be some stupid person, right? Ah yes! When a person starts degraded another with assumptions and then tries to spell out their merits with filled in B.S. it speaks volumns about the person. Yup! you did a fine job.
I have gone to name calling in other threads? really, Peters what other threads? give me the details. You made the accusations now back them up. Or are you all wind? Looking for a partner to agree with you and then you will feel you have won over me. childish and you claim to be educated and act like a school boy. a spoiled little school boy, crying to his teacher about billy. Want name calling, you read the posts and your last one was filled with insults aimed at me as well as this whole thread you started with your intital post trying to discredit me with your BULLSHIT. prove you wrong? I did over and over and I am through with you, you aren't worth any more of my time.  MAO you have been amusing and the sorry part is, you believe your won Bullshit.
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Mississippi - state of mind
WW: So where did you come up with an estimate of 1 % not knowing anything about slavery? Show me the data. Nothing you have written to date has any validity and you have not presented where you have found your so called data or the logic behind your conclusion. Yet you have continually attacked my logic and data.
Did you get beyond highschool math? Did you get beyond 4th year college calculus? Did you get to graduate school stat and advanced math classes? What school did you graduate from? If so I retract my statement. If not my statement stands.
Show me how you got your numbers and quit telling me that my assumptions are wrong. Where are your statistics backing your statements?
Did you look at the logic behind the numbers in the posted link. Yes there are assumptions and yes I know there are errors in the data. In a poll of 9 million people the errors will tend to average out. The answers might be one or 2 points off, but 30 as you claim seems hard to believe?
Concerning marines, you are like most I have met, right when wrong, always prepared for a fight and never willing to back down. Very predictable. In high school we thought it was sport to go down to the city and kick marine ass so we could be carded, sent home and have the marine in irons and have to admit he was thumped by a 16 year old. From my point of view you were better with one of me than at 10 marines of the marines I met. You were the one that start denigrading people who where non military.
You stated that I knew nothing about what men talk about in camp etc and there is no way they would talk about the reasons for the war and slavery. I am stating that in the logging camps and fire camps we did talk about such things. Naturally I can underestimate the intelligence of the average US or confederate military person.
You stated you have studied civil war history and as a Ph.D. nothing I say is valid as I have not an expert in civil war history. Do you know what Ph.D. stand for? So you read a few books and you are now an expert? Where is your data to back your claim. Where is your degree in history? Or are a few diaries and the odd book the whole basis of your opinion? How have you trained your mind to think critically about what is presented? From what I have read here?
I am not your average school boy. I paid my way through school doing jobs that made being a being a marine in Vietnam look safe. What draft did I avoid? There was no draft for me. I looked into military flight training after college, but would not be accepted due to my bad knee.
By the way we mixed napalm to start fires and used exposives in the woods on other jobs. Not the most dangerous material I have worked with.
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Mississippi - state of mind
Peters
You sure toot you own horn alot and your PhD means jack shit when it comes to the Civil War, ZERO POINT Shit. Your PhD is only good for your major, I suppose you know how to do Surgery too because you have a friggin PHd? MAO give it up will you, you are making such an ass of yourself.
Look at you, you shove bible verse in people's faces and you set a real good example. I am suppose to believe anything you say? I do not. You have no credibility as far as I am concern, you defend your bullshit with ignorance and Soapboxing with credentials that if you really had them you would know the moron you are making of yourself. Any basic math person can see the flaws in your statement about percentage of families owning slaves and you show your arrogance by continuing to defend it. You talk the talk but sure don't walk the walk. I do not believe a word you say.
You mixed Napalm to start fires in the woods, really? how did you mix it with what and what percentage? What Explosives did you use? Come on be careful now, because your answer will tell me how much Bullshit you are throwing.
Oh wow! I am sorry, you LOOKED into Military Flight School, Oh! and you had a bad little knee so they didn't take you? Bullshit.
You had jobs that made a Marine in Vietnam look SAFE, Good God, you just keep going, there is no end to your bullshit. Damn.... I paid my way through College with the GI Bill, did 6 years and hardly paid a dime out of my own pocket, who is the fool now?
Kick Marines Asses, MAO, you sure can sling the shit. Sure you did, I bet you did. God, you aren't even a Bible Believer as you claim, you are nothing more than a WANNABE a DREAMER.
Good Bye.. you are way too much, I have my feet off the floor because it is getting so deep with every post you post. You best go back and reread the posts, you were the first to throw the mud. This whole Thread was started by you, was it not. Now doesn't the Bible say to turn the cheek? whatsa matter, your Love of God is Bullshit too? You do a lot of pretending is there anything REAL in your life????? I am done with you, I will not respond to any more of your arrogant posts. Knock yourslef out and go sling your Bullshit to someone who believes you, I do NOT.
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